For information: The W3C charter of the RTC-Web related activity there

Enclosed is the (HTML format) current proposal for a W3C activity. Discussion of this is not a DISPATCH activity, so should go to the rtc-web list until further notice. Harald

On Thu, 06 Jan 2011 12:55:03 +0100, Harald Alvestrand <harald@alvestrand.no> wrote:
Enclosed is the (HTML format) current proposal for a W3C activity. Discussion of this is not a DISPATCH activity, so should go to the rtc-web list until further notice.
Harald
I would suggest that teleconferences be limited to a minimum, following <http://www.w3.org/2007/03/HTML-WG-charter>, which says: Teleconferences: up to 1 per week, as needed My expectation would be that no teleconferences are ever needed, as it is a terrible medium for discussing technical issues. In particular, no WG decisions should ever be taken in a teleconference, as that would force everyone to call in at the right time and listen to an hour of hissing/bubbling sounds just to have their vote count. -- Philip Jägenstedt Core Developer Opera Software

On 01/14/11 10:15, Philip Jägenstedt wrote:
On Thu, 06 Jan 2011 12:55:03 +0100, Harald Alvestrand <harald@alvestrand.no> wrote:
Enclosed is the (HTML format) current proposal for a W3C activity. Discussion of this is not a DISPATCH activity, so should go to the rtc-web list until further notice.
Harald
I would suggest that teleconferences be limited to a minimum, following <http://www.w3.org/2007/03/HTML-WG-charter>, which says:
Teleconferences: up to 1 per week, as needed
My expectation would be that no teleconferences are ever needed, as it is a terrible medium for discussing technical issues. In particular, no WG decisions should ever be taken in a teleconference, as that would force everyone to call in at the right time and listen to an hour of hissing/bubbling sounds just to have their vote count.
I have found that teleconferences can be extremely useful as "timeline punctuation". I disagree with the idea that everyone who watches/reviews a proposal needs to be on every teleconference every time, but it can be useful as a method to sync chairs, editors and other people who have taken on responsibilities - they're good for effort management, but as you say, bad for technical discussions except (possibly) at critical junctures. The W3C people have said that this can be adjusted dynamically by the WG chairs. Harald

My experience of the W3C teleconferences is that that the online tool linkage can make them remarkably effective. (The various 'bots' that run on the IRC channel). Issues, action items, agenda items, and so on can be tracked automatically, and so on. On Jan 14, 2011, at 12:47 , Harald Alvestrand wrote:
On 01/14/11 10:15, Philip Jägenstedt wrote:
On Thu, 06 Jan 2011 12:55:03 +0100, Harald Alvestrand <harald@alvestrand.no> wrote:
Enclosed is the (HTML format) current proposal for a W3C activity. Discussion of this is not a DISPATCH activity, so should go to the rtc-web list until further notice.
Harald
I would suggest that teleconferences be limited to a minimum, following <http://www.w3.org/2007/03/HTML-WG-charter>, which says:
Teleconferences: up to 1 per week, as needed
My expectation would be that no teleconferences are ever needed, as it is a terrible medium for discussing technical issues. In particular, no WG decisions should ever be taken in a teleconference, as that would force everyone to call in at the right time and listen to an hour of hissing/bubbling sounds just to have their vote count.
I have found that teleconferences can be extremely useful as "timeline punctuation". I disagree with the idea that everyone who watches/reviews a proposal needs to be on every teleconference every time, but it can be useful as a method to sync chairs, editors and other people who have taken on responsibilities - they're good for effort management, but as you say, bad for technical discussions except (possibly) at critical junctures.
The W3C people have said that this can be adjusted dynamically by the WG chairs.
Harald
_______________________________________________ RTC-Web mailing list RTC-Web@alvestrand.no http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/rtc-web
David Singer Multimedia and Software Standards, Apple Inc.

On Jan 14, 2011, at 4:15 AM, Philip Jägenstedt wrote:
On Thu, 06 Jan 2011 12:55:03 +0100, Harald Alvestrand <harald@alvestrand.no> wrote:
Enclosed is the (HTML format) current proposal for a W3C activity. Discussion of this is not a DISPATCH activity, so should go to the rtc-web list until further notice.
Harald
I would suggest that teleconferences be limited to a minimum, following <http://www.w3.org/2007/03/HTML-WG-charter>, which says:
Teleconferences: up to 1 per week, as needed
My expectation would be that no teleconferences are ever needed, as it is a terrible medium for discussing technical issues. In particular, no WG decisions should ever be taken in a teleconference, as that would force everyone to call in at the right time and listen to an hour of hissing/bubbling sounds just to have their vote count.
I think it bears repeating that IETF WG are supposed to make decisions by rough consensus, not votes, and WG decisions are supposed to be made / confirmed on the WG mailing list. So, from the standpoint of making decisions, teleconferences are not needed. They can, however, be very useful. Regards Marshall
-- Philip Jägenstedt Core Developer Opera Software _______________________________________________ RTC-Web mailing list RTC-Web@alvestrand.no http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/rtc-web

On Jan 14, 2011, at 8:57 AM, Marshall Eubanks wrote:
On Jan 14, 2011, at 4:15 AM, Philip Jägenstedt wrote:
On Thu, 06 Jan 2011 12:55:03 +0100, Harald Alvestrand <harald@alvestrand.no> wrote:
Enclosed is the (HTML format) current proposal for a W3C activity. Discussion of this is not a DISPATCH activity, so should go to the rtc-web list until further notice.
Harald
I would suggest that teleconferences be limited to a minimum, following <http://www.w3.org/2007/03/HTML-WG-charter>, which says:
Teleconferences: up to 1 per week, as needed
My expectation would be that no teleconferences are ever needed, as it is a terrible medium for discussing technical issues. In particular, no WG decisions should ever be taken in a teleconference, as that would force everyone to call in at the right time and listen to an hour of hissing/bubbling sounds just to have their vote count.
I think it bears repeating that IETF WG are supposed to make decisions by rough consensus, not votes, and WG decisions are supposed to be made / confirmed on the WG mailing list. So, from the standpoint of making decisions, teleconferences are not needed. They can, however, be very useful.
Of course, I was referring to IETF WG telechats. Dave Singer reminds me that this is a mixed list - were you referring to W3C telechats ? Regards Marshall
Regards Marshall
-- Philip Jägenstedt Core Developer Opera Software _______________________________________________ RTC-Web mailing list RTC-Web@alvestrand.no http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/rtc-web
_______________________________________________ RTC-Web mailing list RTC-Web@alvestrand.no http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/rtc-web

On Jan 14, 2011, at 16:21 , Marshall Eubanks wrote:
I think it bears repeating that IETF WG are supposed to make decisions by rough consensus, not votes, and WG decisions are supposed to be made / confirmed on the WG mailing list. So, from the standpoint of making decisions, teleconferences are not needed. They can, however, be very useful.
Of course, I was referring to IETF WG telechats. Dave Singer reminds me that this is a mixed list - were you referring to W3C telechats ?
/me points at the subject line :) W3C groups typically make use of phone conferences, but how important they are in the group's functioning depends on how the group decides to organise itself. Most groups carry out at least some minimal phone discussions, but some have none at all. As David said, despite the phone being a horrible medium for, well, pretty much anything, telcons can in fact be productive thanks to the many good tools surrounding them. Also, the rhythm they impose means that people tend to get their action items done more or less on schedule. -- Robin Berjon robineko — hired gun, higher standards http://robineko.com/
participants (5)
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David Singer
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Harald Alvestrand
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Marshall Eubanks
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Philip Jägenstedt
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Robin Berjon