Input Needed: Media Type Registry Structure
Community input needed: During IESG evaluation of draft-hoehrmann-script-types, one of the General Area reviewers provided this comment: "IANA seems to have figured out that the types to be registered are MIME media types but probably should be told how to indicate that the two text/ registrations are obsolete, or at least that it is important to mark these registrations as obsolete in the registry (unless the OBSOLETE intended usage field in the registration suffices, but marking the registry entry will be more effective)." Follow-up discussion within the IESG has prompted this query. The templates in draft-hoehrmann-script-types use the "Intended Usage" field in the templates to note that two of the types are obsolete. The reviewer is suggesting that this status be displayed more obviously at a higher level within the registry. This isn't exactly an issue for the document being reviewed, but it might be an issue for the structure of the registry. Should the registry structure be changed to display the status of obsolete (or any other) types more prominently? If so, we might need a new document or a revision to draft-freed-media-type-reg to describe whatever changes are needed. -Scott-
On Thursday, June 23, 2005, 2:22:48 PM, Scott wrote: SH> Community input needed: SH> During IESG evaluation of draft-hoehrmann-script-types, one of the General SH> Area reviewers provided this comment: SH> "IANA seems to have figured out that the types to be registered are MIME SH> media types but probably should be told how to indicate that the two text/ SH> registrations are obsolete, or at least that it is important to mark these SH> registrations as obsolete in the registry (unless the OBSOLETE intended SH> usage field in the registration suffices, but marking the registry entry SH> will be more effective)." Yes, it would be more effective, but I can live with either marking it or leaving people to read the registration documents. SH> Follow-up discussion within the IESG has prompted this query. The templates SH> in draft-hoehrmann-script-types use the "Intended Usage" field in the SH> templates to note that two of the types are obsolete. The reviewer is SH> suggesting that this status be displayed more obviously at a higher level SH> within the registry. I agree that this information is not obvious when looking at the registry, and is useful. SH> This isn't exactly an issue for the document being reviewed, but it might be SH> an issue for the structure of the registry. Should the registry structure SH> be changed to display the status of obsolete (or any other) types more SH> prominently? If so, we might need a new document or a revision to SH> draft-freed-media-type-reg to describe whatever changes are needed. It could be as simple as putting a class attribute in the HTML and styling common, limited and obsolete in different colors. -- Chris Lilley mailto:chris@w3.org Chair, W3C SVG Working Group W3C Graphics Activity Lead
On Thu June 23 2005 10:46, Chris Lilley wrote:
It could be as simple as putting a class attribute in the HTML and styling common, limited and obsolete in different colors.
While I agree with most of Chris' other remarks, I note that color variations encoded in HTML (particularly if more complex methods such as style sheets are used) would be particularly difficult for readers with certain visual impairments. I'd prefer a field that indicates status explicitly in text. I'd rather not have to dig through actual registrations, since it is conceivable that a registration might change after initial registration (I believe that there are several such proposals in discussion).
On Thursday, June 23, 2005, 5:40:46 PM, Bruce wrote: BL> On Thu June 23 2005 10:46, Chris Lilley wrote:
It could be as simple as putting a class attribute in the HTML and styling common, limited and obsolete in different colors.
BL> While I agree with most of Chris' other remarks, I note that color BL> variations encoded in HTML (particularly if more complex methods BL> such as style sheets are used) would be particularly difficult for BL> readers with certain visual impairments. Which was why I suggested using a class attribute and styling, rather than say a font tag to set the color directly. This allows restyling, alternate style sheets, automatic extraction and so forth. BL> I'd prefer a field that indicates status explicitly in text. Yes, that would work too, and probably be preferable. BL> I'd rather not have to dig through actual registrations, since it BL> is conceivable that a registration might change after initial BL> registration (I believe that there are several such proposals in BL> discussion). Good point. -- Chris Lilley mailto:chris@w3.org Chair, W3C SVG Working Group W3C Graphics Activity Lead
I think we should separate out questions about the schema -- whether the "Intended Usage" field being "obsolete" means that the entire registration is obsolete -- from questions about the presentation -- how IANA media type registry information is made available to the community, what it looks like, what other tools are available for finding, reading, marking, downloading, interpreting. I suggest that the latter is more of a topic for "IETF tools" discussions (tools-discuss@ietf.org), and that we should look generally at making the IANA web pages more useful for its various audiences. As for the former, I think that using the "Intended Usage" field in the registration schema to note registrations that are "Obsolete" is a reasonable choice. Larry
I think we should separate out questions about the schema -- whether the "Intended Usage" field being "obsolete" means that the entire registration is obsolete -- from questions about the presentation -- how IANA media type registry information is made available to the community, what it looks like, what other tools are available for finding, reading, marking, downloading, interpreting.
I suggest that the latter is more of a topic for "IETF tools" discussions (tools-discuss@ietf.org), and that we should look generally at making the IANA web pages more useful for its various audiences.
I could not agree more. Putting this sort of thing in registration specification is entirely inappropriate IMO, if for no other reason than these presentation issues tend to apply to mutiple, and maybe even most, IANA registries. There are all sorts of improvements I could envision making to many of the IANA registries, including but not limited to: (1) Better layout and use of things like color indicators. (The fact that these are of no use to some folks doesn't mean they are of no use to everyone.) (2) Nail down the URL used to locate various things (this is a longstanding W3C request, and while I am sympathetic to the IETF view that not everything is a URL, there are real benefits to having some of this stuff in fixed locations.) (3) Dare I suggest an ATOM/RSS feed where all IANA updates get posted? Perhaps even one where incoming requests get sent as well?
As for the former, I think that using the "Intended Usage" field in the registration schema to note registrations that are "Obsolete" is a reasonable choice.
Agreed. Ned
* Scott Hollenbeck wrote:
Follow-up discussion within the IESG has prompted this query. The templates in draft-hoehrmann-script-types use the "Intended Usage" field in the templates to note that two of the types are obsolete. The reviewer is suggesting that this status be displayed more obviously at a higher level within the registry.
FWIW, <http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2048.txt>, section 2.7 states: Media type registrations may not be deleted; media types which are no longer believed appropriate for use can be declared OBSOLETE by a change to their "intended use" field; such media types will be clearly marked in the lists published by IANA. application/vnd.informix-visionary and application/iges (see the model/ iges registration) seem to be the only types that should be marked obsolete in the registry and for the former the registration notes: http://www.iana.org/assignments/media-types/application/vnd.informix-visiona... Note: This registration is obsolete. The registration of vnd.visionary replaces this registration. Note posted: 05 February 2002 There does not seem to be a similar note for application/iges and the lists at http://www.iana.org/assignments/media-types/application/ etc. do not mark these types as obsolete. -- Björn Höhrmann · mailto:bjoern@hoehrmann.de · http://bjoern.hoehrmann.de Weinh. Str. 22 · Telefon: +49(0)621/4309674 · http://www.bjoernsworld.de 68309 Mannheim · PGP Pub. KeyID: 0xA4357E78 · http://www.websitedev.de/
participants (6)
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Bjoern Hoehrmann -
Bruce Lilly -
Chris Lilley -
Larry Masinter -
Ned Freed -
Scott Hollenbeck